SmartTranscript of House Human Services - 2025-04-01 - 1:05 PM

[42 seconds of silence] [Chair Theresa Wood]: Good afternoon, everyone. Welcome to health services. Today is Tuesday, April first. We are jumping into our oversight and excitement. [Witness Amy Rose]: I'm just not gonna use this, and you cannot make it. I'm just not gonna use this. [Chair Theresa Wood]: Thank you. So we have with us Amy Rose. You've been here, so I don't think we need to do introductions. I will turn it over to [Witness Amy Rose]: you. Welcome. Thank you. Thank you for having me. For the record, my name is Amy Rose. I am the policy director with Voices for Vermont's Children. I apologize that the slides didn't come through, but you should have them there, and you can follow along, and feel free to stop me if you have questions. So the testimony today is going to focus on the Reach Ahead pilot, but I just wanted to kind of start with some context around how we got here and, want to start with appreciation for the work of this committee and your focus on people and your values and your guiding principles. Oftentimes, when we talk about these programs, we kind of start with what is the role of government, kind of what are our values. So I wanted to just share Vermont's strategic plan. This is the most recent version. I'm not out of date, but I think it will hopefully be updated soon. But these are the four buckets that Vermont uses to guide our practices and our principles. And one of the guiding principles is protecting the vulnerable. And you can see there's some breakthrough indicators listed in that, one of which is the percent of the population living at or below two hundred percent of the federal poverty level. This matters because we chat. Yes. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Just a minute. So we have an opportunity to share the slides from our committee assistant. Great. If you, just let her know when you wanna move to the next slide. Is that something [Witness Amy Rose]: Sorry. It there was [Member Anne B. Donahue]: a new version, so I might have the old version. It's okay. Yes. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Okay. We're great. So why don't we wait just a second? Thank you. Thank you, Lauren. We had a well, that's happening. Oh, she was so fast. I don't even have time to tell my story. It's and so we're up there under the strategic plan right now. [Witness Amy Rose]: Yeah. So this strategic plan covers the year twenty eighteen to twenty twenty three, but it's the most up to date version that's out there right now. So if we go to protecting the vulnerable, which is the third side down, [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: the Oh, now it's just a second. Hold on. Okay. It's gonna work. Okay. It's gonna work. [Witness Amy Rose]: I can just keep talking while it's going on, but if that works. Slide three, please. The framework for that, it says, we will protect the most vulnerable by providing services and benefits aimed at lifting more Vermonters out of poverty, ensuring the greatest degree of participation and independence, protecting children, and improving overall health and wellness for our communities. So this is part of the governor's strategic plan. And there's three there's four breakthrough indicators below. One is the percent of poverty of the population living at or below two hundred percent of the federal poverty level. One is rate of homelessness and housing stability. One is kindergarten readiness. And then the last is the percent of population with access to comprehensive health care. We can move on to the next one. We've talked about Reach Up quite a bit in this committee, but we often talk about sort of the Reach Up component of the Reach Up program, and there's multiple layers of the program. So I just I won't spend a lot of time on them, but I just kinda wanna share a little bit about the different parts of the Reach Up program. The overall broad mission, and this is the department's language, we join families on their journey to overcome obstacles, explore opportunities, improve their finances, and reach their goals. The vision is that families will be empowered, connected, and thriving. And there's four key programs to achieve this. There's Reach Up, Reach First, Reach Ahead, actually five, Postsecondary Education, and then the child only Reach Up grants. You can go to the next slide. I just want to share that April is National Child Abuse Prevention Month. I see that many of you have your pins on. And this is connected because Reach Up and other anti poverty programs are really strong prevention tools. We've known this for a long time, but there's a great deal of emerging research from Chapin Hall and others that can really quantify how investing in people's basic needs really helps support families and decreases the needs for the higher end interventions. Here's a slide. Nearly eighty five percent of families investigated by child protective services have incomes below two hundred percent of the federal poverty line. And it ties in well to the strategic plan as well. That threshold seems to be a common touch point. We can move on to the next one. Here's some more recent data out of Chapin Hall, the effect of material hardship on child welfare involvement. So experiencing any type of material hardship, whether it be food, housing, utilities, or medical, is strongly associated with an elevated risk for child protection services involvement. And they've been able to break that down further. And they say that if a family experiences at least one of those hardships, their likelihood of being investigated for neglect increases by three times. Their likelihood of being investigated for physical abuse increases by four times. If families experience multiple types of material hardship, then the numbers only go up. So, the likelihood of being investigated for goes up by four times for investigations and seven times for physical abuse. We'll move on to Reach Up or Reach First. So Reach First is sort of the the entry level sort of short term assistance program connected to the Reach Up program. So people will apply for Reach First if they think they will not likely need help for more than four months at a time. Move on to Reach Up. Oops. And, you [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: know, we have a member on our committee who was involved with the creation of those, yes, supports and services and came up with the names for them. [Witness Amy Rose]: Much better than I, but the post secondary education program is another component of the reach out program, and that will help folks with monthly cash payments, with support services like case management, with childcare, transportation, and school supplies. And people are eligible if they live in Vermont, if they have a minor or dependent children in their home, if they have households under one hundred and fifty percent of the federal poverty level. And that will help earn undergraduate degrees while they are getting financial support. The next one is a reach out child's only program. We talked about this less often. This provides cash assistance to help adults care for the minor dependent children or relatives of family friends. In order to be eligible for this program, you need to be under eighteen. You need to not be getting Social Security benefits and not be in foster care. You have to have little or no income of their own, and they have to be living with or cared for by someone other than their legal parent or caregiver. Reach Up may be next. Great. So the purpose of the Reachup program, it will dive forward, but, some of the things that I like to highlight in, our department's language is to support parental nurturing, to measure the success of the system by what's best for children, to improve the well-being of children by providing for their immediate basic needs, including food, housing, and clothing. Go on to the next slide. So this is updated data that was provided to us by Public Assets Institute, but I'm sure you've seen versions of this in the past. We know that the VHA benefit is incredibly low and difficult for families to navigate. This graph represents the JFO, Joint Fiscal Office's Basic Needs estimate. So that's, like, a really bare bones estimate of what folks need to meet their basic needs living in Vermont. The Reach Up DCF Basic Needs estimate is about half of that. That typically tracks pretty well with the federal poverty line. And then because of our ratable reduction, we give people a little bit less than half of that. So a reach up benefit for a family of four can be the maximum benefit is nine hundred and seventy six dollars for a month, and that includes housing. Some folks are eligible for housing vouchers, which is extremely helpful, but that comes out of their their nine hundred and seventy six dollars as well. So they take a third of that to pay for their housing voucher. And then the folks who don't have other housing supports have to figure out how to make their monthly benefit work for under twelve thousand dollars a year. Can can [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: you say that again? So let's just say somebody has a a a HUD voucher, you know, for eight hundred dollars a month. Does that mean that that nine seventy six is reduced by eight hundred dollars? [Witness Amy Rose]: By eight hundred dollars? No. So what I've heard from families and from participants is that it's reduced by a third. Third of families are expected to pay a third of their income towards housing. Okay. [Member Anne B. Donahue]: It's not a third of eight hundred. It's a third of the nine Nine nine [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: a third of their total. So the maximum amount [Witness Amy Rose]: that they could get for a month would be the nine seventy six, and that we're gonna take a third of that to pay for their housing. Okay. And then this chart also includes other types of cash benefits that families might be eligible for. So three squares, we know, is the food program, LIHEAP is energy assistance, and Lifeline is a technology support. We can go on to the next slide. You've already seen this, so I'm just gonna kind of pass over it quickly. But this is another slide that just kind of shows the difference between where we are in terms of the cost of basic needs and housing and where the maximum reach up grants currently stand. The next slide shows Reach Ahead. Reach Ahead, we'll spend a little bit more time on that because that's the focus of today's testimony. Reach Ahead helps families transition from Vermont's Reach Up or post secondary education programs to work. The goal of this program is to support folks when they are employed. To be eligible, you must live in Vermont. Your family must include minor children. Your reach up or PSE grant must have closed within the last six months. At least one adult in their family must meet the Reach Up work requirements through paid employment. And you cannot exceed your lifetime limit for Reach Ahead, which is twenty four months. Reach Ahead may provide the following benefits. And so this was the typical reach ahead program, not the pilot that that we'll be talking about. So they can offer supports to help folks maintain a job that can include, for example, cash incentives for working and helping pay for car repairs, workflows, work supplies. And that's often in the, like, special services line of the budget that we talked about. To pay a hundred percent of the child care subsidy, we folks are eligible for the maximum subsidy available. And a cash benefit to help you buy food. So this is an additional cash benefit that you're eligible for if you participate in a typical reach out program. That looks like fifty dollars a month for the first twelve months and then five dollars a month for the remaining twelve months. And the benefit really just kinda keeps the program open. You can go on to the next slide. There's some more recent data that I got from the Reach Up annual report that shows average monthly caseload both for Reach Up and then for Reach Ahead. You can go on to the next slide. My favorite part of the statute or the guiding policy for Reach Up is the line about measuring the success of the program by what is best for children. TANF is a very flexible program, and there's opportunities to shift it and adapt it to make sure that we can help families thrive. We can move on to the pilot part. So the reach ahead pilot was from two thousand and twenty three in July until it would it's planning to end on June thirtieth two thousand and twenty five. You can see that some of the goals in the private on the pilot are very similar to the typical reach ahead program, but the biggest differences are around, so the cash available to the families who participate. My recollection of the conversation when this pilot was being introduced by the department was that there was a little bit of a difference between, the House and the Senate in terms of how you viewed the pilot or, like, opportunities to change. I think your committee did a lot of work around talking about the benefit list and talking about the pilot as an opportunity to help support families while they're working. And so some of the incentive language was taken out, and you tried to front load the program so that people would get more money up front, and then it would decrease over time. In the Senate, it was discussed, I think the department came in and shared that there was a model that they were working from that was a validated model. And so it was really important to kind of stick with the fidelity of the program. And so the language reverted back to the original proposal, which would offer some additional support. So it'd be a hundred dollars a month or six months for the food stipend instead of that fifty, I believe, that was available before for twelve months. And then after that, the next eighteen months, folks are eligible for a fifty dollar stipend for additional food purchases. More meaningful, I think, is that there are these, like, time points when people can get a bigger stipend. And so you can go to the next slide, and this is right from the DCF's information from their report. So basically, families would be eligible for a seven fifty dollars work support payment after six months of maintaining employment. They'd be eligible for one thousand dollars after twelve months, an additional one thousand dollars after eighteen months, and an additional one thousand dollars after twenty four months of maintaining employment. Going to the next slide. So this was in a report submitted to you in terms of sort of where they are right now with reviewing the pilot. I'm going to read parts of this because I think it's helpful. The Reach Ahead pilot program provided supports for working parents transitioning off Reach Up, started its second year in July of twenty twenty four. Participants received an increased food benefit for twenty four months and job retention work payments of seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars to one thousand dollars at six, twelve, eighteen, and twenty four months of participation. All families enrolled in Reach Ahead meet the federal work requirements and contribute to the states meeting the work participation rate. And I think that's an important part. So we we have a better work participation rate, and, we'll share in the next slide is that it's really difficult for folks to meet that rate and participate in the traditional reach out program because our benefit is so low that really any in any sort of income that comes in makes you ineligible. So this allows for us to kind of meet some of those requirements as well. Evaluation of the program has included analyzing administrative data and survey data from participants. I haven't seen that yet, but I know that the department's coming in, so maybe that will be available to you on Thursday. I'm not sure. The pilot concludes on June thirtieth of twenty twenty five. At that time, all data and findings collected during the pilot will be compiled for further review by the administration and relevant stakeholders. This will help determine whether this program has met its intended goals and any potential next steps. In preparation for the pilot's conclusion, the central office team is actively working on a comprehensive communication plan. We will ensure that participants and staff are well informed as we get closer to June with detailed information and next steps shared in a timely manner. That might be something to follow-up on. On Thursday, there was a participant that was hoping to come with and speak with you today, but she had to work, and so she was unable to attend. But she said that she is not at the end of her pilot yet, and it's unclear to her whether she will be eligible for the ending pieces of the stipends once the pilot concludes and has asked and hasn't gotten any information back about, and seems unclear about whether or not people who have recently enrolled will still get the full pilot experience if they meet all the requirements. And so, as you know, we talk a lot about budgeting with Reach Up and other programs. And so, it's really helpful for the families to budget if they know sort of what they'll be getting. We can go on to the next slide. I think I wanted to highlight this because I think it's really important to just kind of connect the Reach Up program and the pilot or Reach Ahead in general. The second paragraph on this slide says that most Reach Up participants' grants will close when they start working, and very little income makes the family ineligible for Reach Up financial assistance. As the average wage has increased, the Reach Up benefit levels have not, driving the income eligibility threshold lower and lower each year. The number of families enrolled in Reach Up has increased from two thirty one in twenty twenty two to two sixty two in twenty twenty three, then to three forty eight in twenty twenty four with the Reach Up pilot program. More families are leaving Reach Up and going to work than in previous years. I imagine you'll see this again from the department. This is their language, not mine. But I think it's important to note that if we're trying to move folks into work, we have to create a space where they can work and maintain employment. And this pilot, I think, was intended to do that. I believe it was a two million dollars appropriation, probably through one time funds. So if we move on to the next slide, some questions that I have yet to find answers to is sort of two million dollars was appropriate for the two year pilot. How long were families accepted into the pilot? Will all the families have the opportunity to benefit from a twenty four months of payment or the payment end in June, even if they're only six months in? What is the base level of preparation for each of you having? I should probably be able to find that, but I tried to look through the budget and have asked for some follow-up documentation, and I'm just not clear how it's all broken out. So I'm not entirely clear what is in the reach ahead budget even in the school year twenty twenty six budget. Those are all questions that we'll be asking. Next slide, if you if we have time, I'll just specifically read. As I mentioned, there's a single mom of two from Caledonia County who is really hoping to be here with me today. She is you'll hear in in her own words that she's participated in each of these programs. She's currently employed. When she is unable to attend work, not only did she miss the salaries from from that the compensation for the hour she missed, but she also gets stalked the next week. And so she really couldn't miss work and be here today, but she was hoping that I would share sort of her experience on her behalf. So it says, good afternoon. I am a single mom of two in Caledonia County, and I was a part of the Reach Up, Reach Ahead, and the Pilot program. I would first like to thank the people who made these programs possible, as they helped me and my kids on our journey to self sufficiency. I have been a part of these programs a couple of different times as the years have gone by. The first time was with my oldest child when he was about a year, and I was a single mom going to college full time. It was great to have financial support from the Reach Up program, but it didn't seem like a lot of money. I believe, if I remember correctly, the original amount for one kid and one adult was four hundred dollars maybe five hundred dollars each month. This may seem like enough money for some people, but between rent, having a phone so you can be reached when your child is at daycare, and other bills, it often wasn't enough. The diapers and wipes were expensive. I know these programs are designed to help get families on their feet, and the goal is to have just enough money to get by, but it would be very helpful to get a little bit more to do the job searches and to pay for rent. Vermont is expensive, and honestly, a family can't do much without a car. These programs were able to help me through, as it did help me find a job and keep a job. I started working at my current job two years ago. I was asked by my reach up case manager this time around if I would like to join a program called the pilot program. In this program, a parent is given incentives more or less to help keep their job. This not only helped me want to stay at my current job, but also helped me with keeping food on the table and a roof over my children's head. My youngest is in daycare Monday through Thursday. Anytime [Member Anne B. Donahue]: this down for you. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: I don't know. [Chair Theresa Wood]: I don't know how to use these. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Brenda? [Witness Amy Rose]: Yes? [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Will you please mute yourself? [Chair Theresa Wood]: I'm trying to figure this out. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Okay. Laurie's gonna mute you. Thank you. [Witness Amy Rose]: Anytime one of my kids is sick or school days or daycare is canceled, I have to miss work. So the incentives have been a nice way to keep keep a balance when I have to miss work. My kids have always and will always be my number one priority. And so to have the extra stability has not only helped me, but it's helped them as well. When I was first on Reach Up and Reach Ahead was when my oldest baby went from Reach Up to Reach Ahead, and I joined the PSE grant program. PSE was another great opportunity. And when I got was on that grant, I was living in a new foundations apartment. It was just a one bedroom, so I shared the room with my child, which was fine. But even with no rent, I still had car insurance and a phone and, again, paying to drive back and forth to day care center along with doctor's appointments and going to get groceries or even just to get out of the house. Four hundred dollars was still a struggle for me. I did make it work by cutting corners on some of the other things, but I didn't have Internet or any specialty things. I only paid for things that were needed, and sometimes I may not have something that I needed, whether it be feminine project products or shampoo and conditioner, because when getting a stipend, it doesn't seem like they all add all of that into account. I made you with what I had, but it was difficult. It has been different with the pilot. The reach ahead pilot helped me with my car when my windshield was broken, and I was hoping to use some of the money for the next ascent incentive to get my yet again craft windshield fixed again. These unexpected expenses can be enough to destabilize a person. If my car doesn't pass its inspection, all the other things fall apart. It's my hope that with this pilot, I will be able to maintain my employment. These programs have been very helpful in my life with my kids to ensure stability. This is something that I understand a lot of families struggle with. I was not expecting to be a single mom in my life ever. So when it happened to me, I didn't know what to do. I was struggling not only financially, but also physically and mentally. If I hadn't been able to get the help from the reach out program, I don't know what I would have done. That was for my firstborn. I didn't have a home on my own. I was living with family to help me take care of not only him, but also myself. And when my second child came around, some of the same things had happened. I thought his dad and I were going to be okay. We'd work. We'd both provide. But when I went through severe postpartum depression and had some struggles, I realized that his dad and I could not be together for multiple reasons. So, again, I found myself providing for another child alone. I had jobs when I found out I was pregnant with both kids, but I had a hard time finding childcare after they were born. This made it even harder for me because I couldn't search for work with a baby on my hip. Now that I've had help from my family, help from these programs, and friends, I have again landed on two feet stronger than ever. I am so grateful that these programs are around and were able to help me in so many different ways. I am better off with the pilot, but things still aren't easy. Expenses are hard in today's society, with eggs being eight dollars a dozen, fruit being expensive. My youngest child is very picky. Some of the things she will eat are fruit and eggs and pancakes, pasta. None of these things are super cheap, and although I get food stamps and WIC, that doesn't even cover everything that my two kids will eat. I end up using some of the money I get from working and some of the money from the incentives to make sure that my kids are nourished. The other thing that has been hard for me has been a change in staffing. When I started on this program, I had one case manager. Then I ended up with another case manager. And, again, this case manager is changing roles, so I'm now being set up with another case manager and also being told I'm getting to the end of the program. With this being said, there are questions. Like, am I getting more stipends? I know I'm supposed to have at least one more, and it's supposed to be the largest one. This last stipend would help me get my windshield fixed and help me due to the fact that I had to take extra time off from work last week due to my youngest having the flu, And I have to take a day off this week due to my youngest having a doctor's appointment. I wish I could be there with you today, but I cannot miss any more work. I know the program is ending. I haven't been told if I will get the remaining stipend even though I have met all requirements of the program. In conclusion, I believe this is an amazing program. This program has served to help me with paying rent, getting a car, and fixing my car, and has helped me in finding and keeping a full time job. This program, if continued, could also help more families like mine, which is amazing for our community. The next slide. I just want to share a little bit of feedback. I've been talking to families who have been participants in WeChat, And I just wanna share just a couple more quick quotes and feedback from them. These two pieces are directly from the Reach Up report that was published this year. Transportation continues to be a major obstacle for families. Currently, two seventy five participants are on the wait list to receive a vehicle. In twenty twenty four, the Reach Up program successfully purchased twenty six state surplus fleet vehicles that were awarded to participants to help them overcome obstacles and reach their goals. This is one of the things that the special funds could do. And so when there's a surplus due to caseload savings, that money could be reinvested and help folks get their cars. Unfortunately, shelter barriers have also increased from nineteen percent in twenty twenty two to twenty two percent in twenty twenty three and again to twenty five percent in twenty twenty four. This is not surprising given the housing crisis throughout Vermont. Families enrolled in reach out who are experiencing poverty rates below forty five percent of the federal poverty level are particularly vulnerable to the lack of affordable housing and housing vouchers. And do the next slide. So this is the feedback that I've received directly from participants. It is impossible to save on a reach out budget, so the reach ahead pilot is extra helpful. Having a housing voucher makes a huge difference. Reach Up participants pay about a third of their max benefit for housing when they have a voucher. And so, again, from that slide of the nine hundred and some odd dollars, about three hundred dollars, it's just impossible to find rent for three hundred dollars. So without the voucher, it's it's just it doesn't work. The next one, my reach up case managers have all been great. They connect me to other programs and resources. It is hard when they change. It's like I'm starting from scratch each time someone new comes in. Another person. I forgot about the special funds. I don't ask for them because they are never available. And then lastly, should be one more slide. K. The last person I spoke to, which was just on Friday, had said, to thank the legislature for asking. It feels good to know that they are thinking about us. Thank you, Amy. Thank you. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Appreciate that. And I I wanna say we also appreciate the the fact that you bring the voices of these Vermonters to the state house every day and that you stick it out. And I hope people know and appreciate the the role that you play in making sure that their voices are heard here [Witness Amy Rose]: in the statehouse. So I just want to say thank you for that. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: So on the reach ahead pilot, and, you know, we'll be talking to DCF more about this [Witness Amy Rose]: on Thursday. Right? Right? Yep. On Thursday. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: It's unclear to us as well, you know, kind of like what's happening with that. I I think from what I have heard, and this is only through the grapevine, that they're just going to allow it to expire. And and yet we are seeing and hearing, and they even report the positive benefits of it. And so it, it's a little confusing to me about something with such a really small investment can reap such, high rewards in terms of outcomes that that we would discontinue that or that they wouldn't seek, you know, they wouldn't seek the authority to extend it. And I don't really know if they have to have well, I guess it does. Yeah. Well, it's it's in session law. So in session laws, it it Right. Has a peep the period of time. So so any event, but, you know, we will be asking about that for sure and trying to figure more out and get more of the details about it. Like, I I don't know I don't know if our our DCF team who was looking at this section, you know, had any, information back about that at all. [Witness Amy Rose]: Okay. Responses to [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Responses to questions. Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead, Anne. [Member Anne B. Donahue]: Gerald, I I would like to give just a mini history of why we created this program Yeah. Because we we didn't do them starting out to do good things for people. That's not bothering. We we were grappling this committee, and this was maybe fourteen, fifteen years ago. We were grappling with a fiscal crisis in that the federal government had imposed a new, set of standards for the work participation rate to be able to get, this was called this was the Welfare Work Reform Act, in order to get funding. And what it did is it it we had a very high work participation rate in Vermont compared to some other states, but it it didn't set a, you know, here's the standard. It said you have to increase your work participation rate by x amount. Otherwise, you get dinged. And that was gonna be really, really tough for Vermont to do because we're doing really well. And so we were standing at a significant risk. So we had actually some expert consultants who came up from Washington. And in all of the brainstorming, one of the things that we're was, you know, thinking about, okay. If you need to get the rate up, then you wanna keep it's the employment rate. You wanna keep people who aren't employed off, and you wanna peep keep people who are employed on. And there were people who would get on reach up because they were in desperate straits, but it was some kind of a relatively short term emergency. The car died. It couldn't get to work. And then you'd have people who were who went off reach up because they found a job and didn't meet criteria, but were face you know, face ended up cycling right back into crisis because, you know, just getting on to work, there was not enough stability. And Ergo was born this concept of, well, if we reach first, we get the people who, with some help, don't have to get on the roles. Those unemployed people don't have to get on the roles. They don't count as part of our enrolled people who aren't meeting the enrollment rate, the employment rate. And if we keep people on the caseload who are employed, and we can keep them there because we're giving them a little bit of continuing help even though they're not eligible for full support, then we keep them on our rate as employed, and it saves us from losing a ton of money. Plus, we were all thrilled. It really makes sense in helping people. So, yes, ultimately, we really wanted to help people, and that was part of it. But the the genesis was it it was you know, would and did save a lot of money in terms of of federal restraints. What what I'm kind of, you know, missing in this catch up now is I I know that the original amount was a hundred dollars for six months for it was food. It was a food stipend, a hundred dollars to help and then fifty dollars for the remaining eighteen months. And it seems that disappeared and turned into five dollars a month just to keep them that's from your slides there. And we set it up as as a hundred for the first six months and then fifty just to help bridge that little bit of extra money, a little bit of extra support. So so this I wasn't that familiar. I wasn't on this committee, I think, when the pilot started with with that special attempt. But but, clearly, those purposes remain the same. If our work participation rate goes down, we we stand to lose significant funding, and this was really key to to helping get past that. So so that's a little bit of history of of how and why it got created. And it still matters. Right. As well as showing real success in its intention of, you know, helping people make that bridge once they get a job, but being able to hang in through a tough transition, but also catching people who don't need to end up on reach up if they get that front end, that reach first, [Chair Theresa Wood]: help. I was in that first group who received the reach ahead that and I do remember the one hundred and the fifty and the spout. [Member Anne B. Donahue]: That was a little extra money. [Chair Theresa Wood]: Little extra money, but it was so essential. And that was the time where it, like, it stuck and I was really able to keep moving forward, and didn't have to go back, into that cycle of poverty and job hunting and and all of that. So [Member Anne B. Donahue]: It's a win win because it's gonna really work to help people. Yeah. Also gonna save us from going off this cliff. [Witness Amy Rose]: I appreciate you sharing that. It is a little bit unclear, and I've tried to, like, did some public record request in trying to understand better how we structure our work requirements and our purchase participation rate, how we structure our TANF budget and the maintenance of effort piece. Right? Because it looked like when the commissioner was here that we're only using a really small amount of our TANF dollars for the check right now. Most of the program is being funded through general funds. And that may be in some ways to help meet a lot of the federal requirements. I think it was in his slideshow, it was about two point eight million dollars. And our TANF block grant is forty seven million, and the rest of the money was made the general funds. But it is tricky. Like, it's a little bit beyond sort of my ability of all of the budgets to figure out where the money goes and how it's all used. And there were some recent changes in the federal level that were going to reset the year for some of those workforce participation rates. And that might be one of the things that we're trying to address is making sure that that we're really meeting all the federal standards. Some of those changes have paused because it was a lot of concern from advocates. I think they got over seven thousand letters in the federal level about it, but some of them probably remain. Right? And so it will be helpful to get a better understanding of how that's all figured out and if this program is really one of the keys to making sure that we can draw down all of our federal dollars. Any questions for the witness? Oh, yeah. Just what year was that that the federal government changed that requirement and then we responded? [Member Anne B. Donahue]: Do you remember when we create I don't remember. It was I don't, but [Witness Amy Rose]: I can get it back to you. Yeah. I was just curious. [Member Anne B. Donahue]: Yeah. It was it it feels like it was ten years ago. It was a lot more than that because I was off this committee for, you know, like, eight years, and then I've been back for three years. Uh-huh. And it was well before that. If anybody remembers when the Valentine's blizzards of whatever year, that was the year because we were here till ten or eleven at night because we had these consultants from Washington, DC, it's presumed, who were here, and we needed to make use of them, and we were here as the snow piled up. So whatever year the Valentine's blizzard was, that's the year. And that's and that was in response to the the welfare reform act that [Chair Theresa Wood]: we passed. Thousand seven. [Witness Amy Rose]: I was just gonna say it was [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: it was before two thousand eight. I remember that. [Member Anne B. Donahue]: Two thousand and seven. So almost twenty years ago. [Witness Amy Rose]: Yep. Oops. It was pretty yeah. [Chair Theresa Wood]: Yeah. My daughter was, like, two or three. Yeah. K. [Witness Amy Rose]: Great. Thank [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: you, Amy. You really appreciate it. [Witness Amy Rose]: Thank you. [Vice Chair Golrang "Rey" Garofano]: Okay. Folks, we have our next witness at two PM. So just letting folks know that if you have this is total different non sequitur, but, we received, some hard copies of the Developmental Disabilities, annual report. It's probably more information than, you thought you needed. Mhmm. But, so there are copies at the head of the table here, and then Dan has one and Todd has one. And there, if you wanna borrow one, there's one right there on the on the second shelf. But it actually is really helpful to understand what services are being provided, how many people receive those services. So I took a quick look through it. The one thing that it doesn't do that it used to do is to really look at how Vermont stands up against the rest of the country. So we had we used to have national comparisons in here. And now, honestly, it's it's, it's more of a this is how much we do of what we do, which honestly isn't really I mean, it's helpful if you wanna know numbers or you want an idea of what what does service what do the service definitions look like. You can find that in here. I always found the data on how Vermont stacked up to the rest of the country in terms of how how much of our budget was funded by Medicaid compared to other parts of the country, which, you know, spoiler alert, a lot of it. That's that's not in there anymore, but it's still a helpful document in case in case you wanna take a look at something hard copy. We are going to present h ninety one downstairs on Thursday. Is that right, Laurie? So I'm hoping that means that the senate is going to take it up right away. That's supposing that it passes tomorrow on third reading. And thank you for the the team who did the work on the floor this morning. Appreciate that. And why don't we take Laurie just go offline for about ten minutes. We'll take a quick ten minute break, and

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